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Subject:Re: [socialcredit] A brief outline of Social Credit
Date:Thursday, March 8, 2007  23:29:16 (-0700)
From:Wallace Klinck <wmklinck @....ca>
In reply to:Message 4545 (written by william_b_ryan)

The defective cost accountancy which characterizes the present credit system as operated by the banking system provides Social Crediters (and society) with their great opportunity to institute the National Dividend and Compensated Price--an opportunity which would not exist if the credit (i.e., "banking") system were in some way otherwise rectified.  While the credit system as operated by the banks  would not be fundamentally altered, the Social Credit measures including the National Dividend, Compensated Price and institution of a National Credit Account would constitute a fundamental modification  of the financial system as it functions as a whole.  In this sense, the "debt system" would certainly be "replaced."  This would indeed bring radical change inasmuch as it would establish genuine consumer control of economic policy--not to mention changed social conditions and relationships of citizens one to another and to the state which latter would then exist to serve rather than dominate the individual.  The nature of production would change so as properly to serve the needs and natural desires of individual citizens.  A small adjustment to the ignition system of a motor vehicle can mean the difference between the vehicle functioning or being useless.  Social Credit may not appear on the surface to be an especially radical or revolutionary policy--but the changes it would bring would be truly profound in a way that no other policy could provide.  I think the seeming divergence of views expressed in the discussion below emerges mainly due to a failure to define clearly the elements of the discussion before proceeding with it.

Sincerely
Wally


On 8-Mar-07, at 8:03 AM, william_b_ryan@yahoo.com wrote:

"If Social Crediters follow the principle that the
credit system must represent reality then the debt
system has to be replaced by one that does."
------------------------------------
-------------------------------------

This doesn't follow at all.  Please note that Douglas
never proposed abolishing the current system and
replacing it with something else.  His proposals for
the dividend and retail discounts can be seen as
ongoing accounting adjustments to the current system. 
Like leap year adjustments to the calendar.


--- Peter <cymric@xtra.co.nz> wrote:

"The consequence is, you have a piling up of debt, you
have in many cases a diminution of purchasing power
being equivalent to the price of the goods for sale.
It is frequently said, 'Your theory must be absurd
because we know that there are periods in which
purchasing power is in excess of the price of the
goods for sale, for instance at the end of a war.'
What people who say that forget is that we were piling
up debt at that time at the rate of ten millions
sterling a day and if it can be shown, and it can be
shown, that we are increasing debt continuously by
normal operation of the banking system and the
financial system at the present time, then that is
proof that we are not distributing purchasing power
sufficient to buy the goods for sale at that time;
otherwise we should not be increasing debt, and that
is the situation." 

This quote is the later part of the one you have
challenged Jim over. Douglas had just been expounding
on the effect of costs not cleared by sale of goods
pertaining to them in their normal balancing/clearance
cycle. ( a deficit between what was produced and what
was sold) If Social Crediters follow the principle
that the credit system must represent reality then the
debt system has to be replaced by one that does.
Because the result of the normal operation of the
banking system increases the banks claim further and
further into the future that doesnt exist, hense it
based on an legal abstraction not a reality. 
Similarly when the future arrives there are costs that
no longer have any representation of reality- expired.
It is a totally inefficient system by the Social
Credit definition of 'efficiency', in every year not
just elections years. 

Peter H




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