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Shameful Economic Eric Enc
An Emergency Progr MODERATO
The State Theory o william_
Re: [socialcredit] Wallace
Re: [socialcredit] Richard
invalidating the S william_
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Richard Cook's lat MODERATO
Re: [socialcredit] John G R
Re: [socialcredit] Peter
Re: [socialcredit] John G R
Re: [socialcredit] Peter
Conflicting Ideas? Joe Thom
more on the State william_
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Re: [socialcredit] John G R
Re: [socialcredit] William
Re: [socialcredit] William
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Re: more on the St william_
Notes on a Return william_
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Monetary Reform an william_
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DEBT, POVERTY & DE Eric Enc
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technical quibble william_
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in point of clarif william_
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"dollar hegemony" william_
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Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
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Subject:Re: [socialcredit] Conflicting Ideas?
Date:Thursday, May 17, 2007  00:50:47 (+1200)
From:William Hugh McGunnigle <wmcgunn @.........nz>
In reply to:Message 4743 (written by Joe Thomson)

Hi Joe
          Your point is well made. My personal view is that Social Credit aims to prevent the creation of credit that is simply being used for usury i.e. creation of debt without any corresponding liability of loss. It is an viable method of ensuring that the goods and services available can be distributed without incuring interest bearing debt. I do not recall Douglas making any statement that would imply that the private banks could not create credit for lending purposes. He simply pointed out that the system did not, of itself, balance, and that the price of the goods and services available did not equal the wages and salaries of those expected to avail themselves of those services. The former exceeded the latter. I do not think it matters where the balancing costs are obtained provided that the funds needed to provide that balance do not incur debt. The great failing of the usurious system of financial funding is the obvious fact that the money created for the system is always less than the money demanded from the system. Douglas's concepts provided a way to overcome the problem and prevent the inertia of the existing system from curbing all human developement.
    Many of the arguments we have seen on this forum are about how this can be achieved. I am not convinced that all are viable or derived from douglas's ideas.
   regards
          Bill Mc G
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 12:53 AM
Subject: [socialcredit] Conflicting Ideas?

It has been my (mis?-) understanding that under Social Credit the private banks would continue to 'create credit' as they do now.  As  'debt', the principle amount of  any individual loan which, as and when re-paid, will be cancelled. 
 
That the current  'problem' in the total repayment of bank created 'credit ('debt') is due mainly to "the progress of the industrial arts" involving a progressive 'generic' displacement of labour.  Causing these 'debts', taken totally, over each cycle of production, to not presently be completely 'self-liquidating' in the aggregate.  
 
At least not without having to engage in further 'capital production' (of goods not coming within the immediate buying range of the public), or engaging in a frenzied necessity for ever greater exports, (for 'money'), to enable them to (currently) be so.  Both often detrimental in several ways to society as a whole. 
 
Social Credit's solution would be to augment the amount of this overall inadequacy in consumer incomes over each chosen 'cost-accountancy' production cycle through the distribution of sufficient 'debt-free' credits to make that productive cycle capable of being fully financially 'self-liquidating'.  That this would allow bank 'debt' to be completely, or at least far more completely than is currently the case,  amortized.
 
Now I am informed that under Social Credit that the ONLY 'new credit' that would come into existance will be through 'debt-free' distributions to 'Citizen/Consumers' by way of the National Dividend and Consumer Price Discount, and these will be determined by having a proper set of National Accounts kept by a National Credit Authority, and distributed by a proposed "People's Bank".  That there would be NO private 'credit creation' by the individual Banks as at present.  And these Banks then, having seen their 'deposits' grow from the creation and distribution to the public of these 'new credits', will in future only lend their customer's deposits.
 
I do not doubt that Douglas could be interpreted this way, since he has been, and by those who've made a long-time study of his works.  My own feeling is that there is something in this interpretation that has been overlooked, though I'm not qualified to put just what it is in a manner that might be understood.  And I may very well be wrong, and what's been proposed might well be just what he intended.  Any comments that might settle this issue once and for all?
 
Joe
 
 
 
 

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