eListas Logo
   The Most Complete Mailing Lists, Groups and Newsletters System on the Net
      HOME    SERVICES    SOLUTIONS    COMPANY    
Home > My Lists > socialcredit > Messages

 Message Index 
 Messages from 4996 to 5055 
SubjectFrom
Re: underconsumpti John Her
Re: underconsumpti william_
Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
Re: underconsumpti william_
Question: William william_
Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
Re: [socialcredit] Martin H
Archival material Joe Thom
Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
archives keith wi
Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
Re: archives william_
question for Joe william_
Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
Re: [socialcredit] keith wi
Re: [socialcredit] william_
Re: [socialcredit] Wallace
Re: [socialcredit] Wallace
Fwd: [socialcredit Wallace
Re: [socialcredit] keith wi
Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
Some more on W N C Joe Thom
Questions regardin william_
Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
Re: Questions rega william_
More on McKenna william_
Re: [socialcredit] keith wi
Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
Re: [socialcredit] Keith Wi
McKenna william_
Re: [socialcredit] Peter
Re: [socialcredit] Wallace
Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
question william_
Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
Frances Hutchinson william_
Re: [socialcredit] Peter
Re: [socialcredit] Peter
Re: [socialcredit] Wallace
"Ecosocialism of F william_
Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
RE: [socialcredit] John G R
Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
Re: [socialcredit] Peter
Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
RE: [socialcredit] John G R
Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
Re: [socialcredit] Martin H
Re: [socialcredit] William
Re: [socialcredit] William
Re: [socialcredit] Peter
Re: [socialcredit] Peter
Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
Re: [socialcredit] William
Re: [socialcredit] William
Re: [socialcredit] Joe Thom
RE: [socialcredit] John G R
Re: [socialcredit] Peter
Re: [socialcredit] Peter
Re: [socialcredit] Peter
 << Prev. 60 | Next 60 >>
 
socialcredit
Main page    Messages | Post | Files | Database | Polls | Events | My Preferences
Message 5033     < Previous | Next >
Reply to this message
Subject:Re: [socialcredit] More on McKenna
Date:Friday, September 21, 2007  12:42:43 (-0700)
From:keith wilde <kwilde @...............org>
In reply to:Message 5032 (written by william_b_ryan)

Following is the last half of a short essay I wrote in connection with the economics literacy test that was discussed here in August.  It starts with testimony of the Bank of Canada Governor to questioning in a committee of the Canadian Parliament.   The last part bears on the timing of McKenna statements about bank creation of money.

McKenna is quoted in Norman Angell's 1929 book , "The Story of Money" from a 1925 statement about the non-necessity of gold in a well-managed monetary system.  It is sufficient to have a good system for managing CREDIT.
===========================================================

    Question:  When you allow the merchant banking system to issue bank deposits —— with the
    practice of using cheques —— you virtually allow the banks to issue an effective substitute for money, do you not ?
    Towers: The bank deposits are actually money in that sense.
    Question: But there is no question about it, that banks create that medium of exchange ? [I.e.
    bank deposits]
    Towers: That is right. That is what they are for.
    Question: And they issue that medium of exchange when they purchase securities or make loans?
    Towers: That is the banking business, just in the way that a steel plant makes steel.
   
In the 1930s context, acknowledgments of this kind seem to have been regarded as a kind of triumph by monetary reformers, as if they had forced out the secrets of a mysterious cult.  A central banker seems not to have been particularly disturbed to make the revelation, however.  And an Australian pamphlet on money reform from the same period quotes the 14th edition of Encyclopedia Britannica as follows:
"Banks create credit.  It is a mistake to suppose that bank credit is created to any extent by the payment of money into the banks. A loan made by a bank is a clear addition to the amount of money in the community." Checking the history of the Encyclopedia confirms that this quotation could have been quite contemporary with the pamphlet, since the 14th edition was published in 1929 and was continuously revised after 1936.  Pushing back further provides a hint of when the money creating power of banks became more widely understood.  The Eleventh Edition of Britannica was published in 1911.  The article “Banks and Banking” in Vol. 3 says this:
   " A bank collects capital from others. It could never prosper if it relied on its own alone. (The author cites David Ricardo, Proposals for an Economical and Secure Currency, on how it is done.)  But it does not hoard.  “It only holds the funds with which it is entrusted till it can use them, and the use is found in the advances that it makes. Some of the deposits merely lie with the bank till the customer draws what he requires for his ordinary everyday wants.  Some, the greater part by far, of the deposits enable the bank to make advances to men who employ the funds with which they are entrusted in reproductive industry, that is to say, in a manner which not only brings back a greater value than the amount originally lent to them, but assists the business development of the country by setting on foot and maintaining enterprises of a profitable description.” [Experts on contemporary finance say that banks no longer fill this function to more than a minor degree.]

A significant change occurs with the Twelfth Edition of Britannica. This one, published in 1922, simply supplemented the original 28 volumes of the 11th edition with the addition of three new ones.  These are described as summarizing the state of the world before, during and after World War I. The article on banking in the 12th edition provides the data to show that deposits of British banks between 1913-4 and 1920-1 increased by 143%.  The author considers why and how.  He notes that some bankers said it was from money waiting for employment in trade (this reflecting the post-war trade slump of 1919-20).  But the author (Wm. F. Spalding, an official Examiner in Banking , Currency and Foreign Exchange) said that
   " [T]he true causes during the war were to be found in the inflation arising out of the Government’s war finance; while immediately after the war, bankers were certainly too free with their advances.  Each advance had the effect of adding to the deposits of some or other bank in the country, since when a person raises a loan with a bank the amount is nearly always credited to his current account.  Obviously, then, an increase in bank loans and advances is concomitant with an increase in bank deposits and … bankers were able to extend their loans in this manner because a large proportion of the inflated deposits of the war period still remained with them as additional cash… . Undoubtedly, the increase in deposits was largely due to the immense creation of Government credits, which eventually found their way into the pockets of producers, and wage-earners, and so on, to the banks. "

This pattern of development in Britannica hints that the understanding of money as credit really began to take hold among even relatively sophisticated observers with the experience of major war finance in the early 20th century.  That leaves a large gap to be explained, since the Bank of England is said to have been  instituted more than two centuries earlier for purposes of war finance.
Keith Wilde
   

william_b_ryan@yahoo.com wrote:

This is excerpted from chapter 9 of *Brief for the
Prosecution." I've attached the full text of that
chapter in PDF. By the way, does anyone know who
claims the copyright to this book?
---------------------------------------------

The Chamberlain family, of sound British stock and
stable middle-class history, rose to considerable but
not outstanding wealth largely through their
connection with the Birmingham firm of Guest, Keen &
Nettlefold, the early manufacturers of the wood-screw
known as "self-driving," i.e., not requiring a hole to
be bored for it.

Later, amongst other interests, they acquired control
of the small joint-stock bank, the Birmingham &
Midland, which, by amalgamation and expansion became
the largest Joint Stock Bank in the world, the present
Midland Bank. Even here their influence is probably
more sentimental than financial.

Prior to 1914-1918 the Chairman of the Bank, Sir
Edward Holden, was known to hold very "advanced" views
on the actual nature of the business carried on by
banks, and its bearing on national policy. The common
idea that a bank is merely a custodian of its clients'
money, which it re-lends at interest to safe
borrowers, was not taken seriously by him, although it
is incorrect to attribute to Sir Edward the
enunciation of the explosive theorem that "Banks
create the means of payment out of nothing"
(Encyclopedia Britannica) which was explicitly stated
by H. D. Macleod in his Theory and Practice of
Banking, at least twenty-five years earlier.

But the history of the Midland Bank during the
Armistice years is marked by several features unique
to it amongst the "Big Five" banks to whom the
numerous smaller banks had in the main been
affiliated. The first of these was the series of
Annual Addresses by Sir Edward Holden's successor, Mr.
Reginald McKenna, a politician rather than a banker,
of which perhaps the most significant was that
containing the famous statement, "The amount of money
in circulation varies only with the policy of the
banks. . . . Every loan creates a deposit, and the
repayment of a loan destroys a deposit . . . the
purchase of a security by a bank creates a deposit,
the sale of a security . . . destroys a deposit."

It is unlikely that these Addresses were actually
written by Mr. McKenna himself, and some grounds exist
for the belief that he did not understand them, but
there is little doubt that they were part of a
considered and immensely important policy operating
through the Bank as an organisation.
-





____________________________________________________________________________________
Got a little couch potato?
Check out fun summer activities for kids.
http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mail&p=summer+activities+for+kids&cs=bz

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Some introductory materials to the discussion topic of this list are at
http://www.geocities.com/socredus/compendium
You're subscribed to this list with the email kwilde@tc-biodiversity.org
For more information, visit http://www.eListas.com/list/socialcredit



Services:  HomeList Hosting ServicesIndustry Solutions
Your Account:  Sign UpMy ListsMy PreferencesStart a List
General:  About UsNewsPrivacy PolicyNo spamContact Us

eListas Seal
eListas is a registered trademark of eListas Networks S.L.
Copyright © 1999-2006 AR Networks, All Rights Reserved
Terms of Service