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(John Rawson wrote:-) I have seen clains that the B. of E.
lent Japan £35 million ab. 1935 to build its fleet. About the time it lent
Nazi Germany £50 million.
(Joe replies:-) I would take it that those sums
would have been spent in Britain, to purchase British-priced goods.
Thereby aiding the all important goal of 'full-employment', no matter what the
eventual cost.
We know Japan was deficient in tool steel, which it had to
source from abroad. Likely most of their machine tools, (lathes, milling
machines, drill presses, as well as heavier machinery ~ "things to make things
with" ~ would have had to have been imported as
well.
And they did not have sufficient iron ore to run their
steel industry, but relied on imported 'scrap'. (And still do ~ samurai
swords aside, their steel is garbage. You cannot machine it
smoothly, it's full of hard spots. Even today American steel (from
Bethlehem Steel , if it can be had) is the best. Beautiful stuff to work
with.)
Also the Japanese would have had to buy all their
petroleum, as everything moved from being coal powered to oil powered. At
that time they'd have been sourcing that from the USA, the Dutch East
Indies (Indonesia), or the British. Who controlled the major oilfield in
Asia then, in Burma. (The facilities that were set ablaze and destroyed by
the retreating British Army just before Rangoon fell to the Japanese~
Saddam wasn't the first to use those tactics! The British based Burmah Oil
Company, Ltd., wanted compensation for their losses from the British
government after the war. I don't know whether they ever got
it.)
I would imagine pre-war Japan had a constantly growing
need to accumulate enough 'foreign exchange' to purchase what it needed to try
to maintain itself as a world-class power. Small wonder they would try to
use their own 'national credit' internally by rather unorthodox
methods if that was the means to their desired end.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2007 12:47
AM
Subject: RE: [socialcredit]
question
I have seen clains that the B. of E. lent Japan £35 million ab.
1935 to build its fleet. About the time it lent Nazi Germany £50
million.
Unfortunately, the usual Socred lack of documentation of sources
prevails.
Regards. John
R.
> Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 15:18:19 -0400
> From:
thomsonhiyu@shaw.ca
> To: socialcredit@elistas.com
>
Subject: Re: [socialcredit] question
>
> (Peter wrote:-) "....the
Bank of England lent such a huge amount of
> credit to Japan that it was
kept a secret."
>
> (Joe replies:-) I don't know about the Bank
of England's secret lending to
> Japan, Peter, but it's plausible. Japan
must have needed considerable
> international credit to go in the short
time that it did from feudal state
> to a modern, industrialised country
complete with a modern, well-equipped
> military, I would think.
>
> There's no question pre-WW I Japan was quite useful to Britain to
have as an
> ally. The Japanese directly checked Russian military
expansionism in the
> Far East and northern China by being the victors
in the Russo-Japanese War
> in 1905. (With considerable covert British
assistance.) Indirectly, the
> weakening of Russia would have removed a
threat from that direction towards
> British interests in India and
Persia (Iran).
>
> After the outbreak of war in Europe in 1914
the Japanese were able to
> wrest control over the 'sphere of influence'
that Germany had established in
> China. The Germans had a substantial
millitary prescence there, including a
> powerful fleet of modern
warships. Evidence of the importance the Kaiser
> attached to what he
reportedly stated to be Germany's most important
> overseas possession.
(Quite likely not so much for what 'goods' China could
> provide
Germany, but as a substantial peace-time 'captive' outlet for
> German
manufactured goods.)
>
> This German Pacific Fleet based in China
was considered to be a prime menace
> to British Columbia, since the
British Empire's main ship-repair facilities
> in the entire Pacific
were then located at Esquimalt, outside Victoria, B.C.
> Destruction of
the large graving dock there, ( one of the few in the world
> that could
accomodate a ship the size of the original Queen Elizabeth ~ and
> did,
during WW II), would have been quite a military accomplishment.
>
> At the outbreak of war in 1914, the Royal Canadian Navy had but
one
> obsolete cruiser to defend this facility, and the entire BC
coast.
> Fortunately, for us, the Japanese Imperial Navy quickly sent
modern ships to
> take up station and defend against what was feared
would be an imminent
> attack. (Prior to that, to bolster the shamefully
inadequate defences, the
> BC Government secretly purchased two
submarines made for the Chilean Navy
> from their US builders. An act
completely 'ultra vires' of its
> Constitutional powers.
'Constitutions', it would seem, CAN be circumvented
> when circumstances
warrant it, and there's a clear indication of public
> support.
)
>
> As it turned out, the anticipated attack never came. The
German Pacific
> fleet divided, with one small group going into the
Indian Ocean, where it
> wreaked havoc on Allied shipping for quite some
time. I believe some of
> those German sailors were later captured, and
interned as POWs in New
> Zealand. Before escaping, I believe, and
somehow making it back to
> Germany.
>
> The main German
force made for home via Cape Horn. Along the way
> annihilating a Royal
Navy task force that intercepted it off the coast of
> Chile. The Royal
Navy later turned the tables off the Falklands, and
> removed that
menace entirely.
>
> I believe the Japanese also sent destroyers
to patrol in the Mediterranean,
> where the Austro- Hungarian Empire's
Navy posed a enemy submarine threat
> for some time.
>
>
After the war, Hirohito was an honoured guest of King George V at the
Royal
> Family's Balmoral estate, an indication of British appreciation
for his
> country's war effort, and that Japan had achieved a unique
status as an
> non-white world power. It must have been somewhat of a
slap in the face
> when their alliance was not renewed by Britain a
short time later.
>
> I think it's quite within the realm of
possibility, as Douglas indicated in
> "The Big Idea", that the
influence of 'International' Finance over
> post-war British policy had
a hand in that.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
From: "Peter" <cymric@xtra.co.nz>
> To:
<socialcredit@elistas.com>
> Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2007 3:54
AM
> Subject: Re: [socialcredit] question
>
>
> >
Douglas was explaining the conflict between the prestege of character
and
> > the prestege of money power. Both Japan and Britain were the
victims of
> the
> > latter at the expense of the
former.
> > In the early part of the century, I am not sure if it was
pre-world war
> one
> > or immediately after that the Bank of
England lent such a huge amount of
> > credit to Japan that it was
kept a secret. It would be inevitable that in
> > the thirties Japan
would have been subject to the banks directions and
> thus
> >
the policy outside their control- doing the opposite to what Douglas
would
> > advise.
> > This circmstance may have had an
influence of Japan's decision to go to
> war
> > upon the US (
some neutral policy!) cutting off her oil supplies.
> > Peter
>
>
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Joe
Thomson" <thomsonhiyu@shaw.ca>
> > To:
<socialcredit@elistas.com>
> > Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2007
12:23 PM
> > Subject: Re: [socialcredit] question
>
>
> >
> > > "....but gave evidence at
> >
> countless official inquiries in Great Britain, Japan,
> > >
Canada, New Zealand and Australia."
> > >>
> > >
(Bill Ryan:-) Question: What "official inquiries" did Douglas give
>
> > evidence to in Japan and Australia?
> > >
> >
> (Joe replies:-) I think Rowbotham might have phrased that a bit
better.
> > >
> > > The "official enquiries" certainly
weren't "countless". At least not if
> > > we're using "official
enquiries" in terms of Douglas's presentation of
> > > evidence
under that designation as it applies to the various
> Committees
>
> > he
> > > appeared before in Ottawa, Alberta, New
Zealand, and the MacMillan one
> > > we've
> > > been
discussing most recently. There are four, by my count.
> >
>
> > > In Japan in 1929, following the presentation of his
paper at the World
> > > Engineering Conference Douglas was
attending in Tokyo, I believe it
> > > would
> > >
have been more correct to state that he was interviewed by "officials"
>
of
> > > that country's Finance Ministry.
> >
>
> > > And, over the period of a week apparently, must have
answered many of
> > > their "inquiries" as to his ideas.
>
> >
> > > I think this would most likely have been the
nature of any "inquiries"
> he
> > > received from
"officials" during his visit to Australia also. Doubtless
> > >
there must have been "countless" conversations where various
"officials"
> > > in
> > > various places made their
own "inquiries" regarding his ideas in
> > > conversation with him
over the years.
> > >
> > > It is interesting to note
that Douglas, despite his evidence before the
> > > Alberta
Agricultural Committee in 1934 where he speaks of the Japanese
> >
> using
> > > "the reverse" of his ideas, still seems to be
quite favourably disposed
> > > towards the Japanese.
> >
>
> > > This is also touched on in his more 'political'
writings in "The Big
> > > Idea",
> > > where he seems
to indicate that Japan, a staunch and effective British
> > >
ally
> > > throughout World War One from start to end, was
subjected to a "loss of
> > > face" when their alliance was
terminated after World War One.
> > >
> > > We have
not discussed what is implied in "the reverse" of his ideas, as
> >
> the
> > > Japanese applied them during the pre-WWII years.
Any comments on that?
> > >
> > > Do you suppose "the
reverse" of Douglas's ideas on national credit also
> > > implies
the "the reverse" of his philosophy regarding the relationship
> >
> between the State and the individual as regards the Japan of that
era?
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original
Message -----
> > > From: <william_b_ryan@yahoo.com>
>
> > To: <socialcredit@elistas.com>
> > > Sent:
Saturday, October 06, 2007 10:24 AM
> > > Subject: [socialcredit]
question
> > >
> > >
> > >> The current
issue of "The Social Crediter" contains
> > >> this statement
from Michael Rowbotham's book, *The
> > >> Grip of
Death*:
> > >>
> > >> "...Douglas was a massive
political influence in his
> > >> day, and a major figure on
the world stage. He not
> > >> only had a world-wide following,
but gave evidence at
> > >> countless official inquiries in
Great Britain, Japan,
> > >> Canada, New Zealand and
Australia."
> > >>
> > >> Question: What
"official inquiries" did Douglas give
> > >> evidence to in
Japan and Australia?
> > >>
> > >>
> >
>>
> > >
>
____________________________________________________________________________
>
> > ________
> > >> Shape Yahoo! in your own image. Join
our Network Research Panel today!
> > >
http://surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7
> >
>>
> > >>
> > >>
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