| Subject: | Re: [socialcredit] Re: [Cap_contacts] Fwd: Banking and the CanadianGovernment - revised | | Date: | Monday, January 7, 2008 21:25:09 (-0500) | | From: | Joe Thomson <thomsonhiyu @....ca>
|
| In reply to: | Message 5191 (written by william_b_ryan) |
(Bill Ryan wrote:-) I do not believe that the falling price
level would be nominal but effective, in terms of
personal income.
(Joe asks:-) So personal incomes (in general) might rise, and consumer
prices (again in general), might also rise, but not as much?
----- Original Message -----
From: <william_b_ryan@yahoo.com>
To: <socialcredit@elistas.com>; "Wallace Klinck" <wmklinck@shaw.ca>;
"Constance Fogal" <conniefogal@telus.net>; "Wendy Forrest"
<forrwen@gmail.com>
Cc: "Joe Thomson" <thomsonhiyu@shaw.ca>; "Diane Boucher"
<cresoc@ccapcable.com>; "Don Martin" <Donald.Martin@fsbdial.co.uk>; "Jim
Schroeder" <jschroeder@shaw.ca>; "Michael Stephen Lane"
<outoftheashes@prodigy.net>; "Barry & Theresa Dunford"
<roseheart@sacredconnection.ndo.co.uk>; "Robert E. Klinck"
<robert.klinck@gmail.com>; "Bill Daly" <b.daly@woosh.co.nz>; "Frances
Hutchinson" <f.g.hutchinson@btinternet.com>; "Martin Hattersley"
<jmartinh@shaw.ca>; "Therese Tardif" <thtardif@hotmail.com>; "Don
Auchterlonie" <jimjamdon@hotmail.com>; "Victor Bridger"
<socialcredit@ecn.net.au>; "Henry Raynel" <henry.raynel@actrix.co.nz>; "Anne
Goss" <ag.socred@btinternet.com>; "Richard Cook" <rickycook21@hotmail.com>;
"William B. Ryan" <william_b_ryan@yahoo.com>; "Betty Luks" <betty@alor.org>
Sent: Monday, January 07, 2008 12:10 PM
Subject: [socialcredit] Re: [Cap_contacts] Fwd: Banking and the
CanadianGovernment - revised
> Wally, I just noted a typographical error in your
> email from earlier today:
>
> "...the consumer is charged, properly, with capital
> appreciation while, quite improperly, not credited
> with capital appreciation."
>
> Which I think should read:
>
> "...the consumer is charged, properly, with capital
> depreciation while, quite improperly, not credited
> with capital appreciation."
>
> This requires explanation and clarification, which
> I'll be glad to discuss in further detail on the
> socialcredit list.
>
> Surely we're not referring to capital appreciation in
> the ordinary accounting sense, but perhaps in the
> sense of the "communal capital" deriving from the
> social heritage and increment of association, which
> determine in part productive capacity. Making it
> possible for the public to more fully draw upon the
> communal capital, which is naturally increasing, is
> one of the justifications for the national dividend in
> its various forms. The analogy is to the corporate
> dividend drawing upon the capital of the firm.
>
> The second point I would like to discuss is the
> contention that the national dividend (and retail
> discount, etc.) would result necessarily in a falling
> price level. I do not believe that the falling price
> level would be nominal but effective, in terms of
> personal income.
>
> Bill
>
>
> --- Wallace Klinck <wmklinck@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
> Thanks for the video Web links below, Connie and
> Wendy.
>
> While the videos review, with varying accuracy,
> certain important aspects of banking history and
> banking procedures, especially in the Canadian
> context, they tend to overlook the critical factors
> which should be considered in the crafting of a proper
> monetary system. By advocating the creation of money
> solely by the Bank of Canada they appear to be
> promoting a centralized form of credit control which
> seems not really that dissimilar to that which was
> utilized by both the communist and fascist states--the
> central economic policy of which was "full-employment'
> as a social policy promoted and/or administered by the
> State. The video commentators tend to regard interest
> as the central economic evil while completely failing
> to deal with the more fundamental error in national
> cost accountancy wherein the consumer is charged,
> properly, with capital appreciation while, quite
> improperly, not credited with capital appreciation.
> This accountancy error is the
> primary cause of escalating unrepayable debt, the
> elimination of which latter would obviate problems
> attributed to interest. Where the consumer is
> empowered to liquidate all financial costs of current
> production with adequate current financial income,
> there is no cost carry-over charges against future
> cycles of production. Where no accumulating consumer
> debt is necessary the "problem" of interest becomes
> non-existent. The remedial measures advocated by the
> video presenters stress the need for state control and
> issue of credit issued as debt, albeit at low or zero
> rates of interest. The important issue, which they
> overlook, is the decentralization of credit control
> which must properly be achieved through the issue,
> from outside the price, or costing, system, of
> consumer credits which are not registered as debt
> and--which are distributed to all citizens as
> consumers as a beneficial share in the communal
> capital. Through use of such consumer credit to
> compensate prices at point of retail, this would
> result in a falling price level and would be in
> keeping with the natural law of cost which is the
> national ratio of consumption divided by the national
> rate of production. A portion of the required
> consumer credit issued directly to each citizen as an
> addition to income regardless of whether or not the
> individual is receiving earned income would recognize
> the entitlement of all to an inalienable inheritance
> in the Cultural Heritage of mankind--based upon the
> reality that labor factors of production are,
> relatively, being replaced by non-labor factors.
>
> Sincerely
> Wally Klinck
> >
> > On 6-Jan-08, at 10:33 PM, Constance Fogal wrote:
> >
> > > Cap_contacts list: For removal send email
> > >
> >
> Cap_contacts-unsubscribe@falstaff.canadianactionparty.ca
> > > --
> > >
> > > CANADIAN ACTION PARTY/PARTI ACTION CANADIENNE
> > > LEADER, CONSTANCE (Connie) FOGAL
> > > www.canadianactionparty.ca
> > > Telephone Connie Fogal at: 604 872 2128
> > >
> > > ----- Forwarded message from Wendy Forrest
> > <forrwen@gmail.com> -----
> > > Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2008 12:38:47 -0500
> > > From: Wendy Forrest <forrwen@gmail.com>
> > > Reply-To: Wendy Forrest <forrwen@gmail.com>
> > > Subject: Banking and the Canadian Government -
> > revised
> > > To: forrwen@gmail.com
> > >
> > > Woo Hoo: Hooray for Gerald Brutus!
> > >
> > > Gerald has done this awesome video on the Bank of
> > Canada and has just
> > > updated it further. Of course he mentions CAP so
> > its a great
> > > resource for
> > > campaiging. He also includes a bit of Bill Abram
> > from his wonderful
> > > The
> > > Crime of the Canadian Banking System. He also has
> > a plug for Paul
> > > Grignon's
> > > excellent Money as Debt. Please forward widely!
> > >
> > > Banking and the Canadian Government
> > > http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=WPSoQfumzQ0
> > >
> > >
> > > For those of you who haven't seen those other
> > videos yet -
> > >
> > > Bill Abram
> > >
> > > Part 1 The Crime of the Canadian Banking System
> > >
> >
> http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=O8Zl1Wax8MI&feature=related
> > >
> > > Part 2 The Great Canadian Experiment
> > >
> >
> http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=9yYEFuN2v08&feature=related
> > >
> > > Part 3 Gerald G. McGeer: A True Canadian Hero
> > >
> >
> http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=zB7GbM1OgzA&feature=related
> > >
> > >
> > > Money as Debt
> > >
> >
> http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-9050474362583451279
> > >
> > > Check out the related videos - there's one of me
> > at Toronto City
> > > Council in
> > > the summer regarding the new proposed taxes,
> > including a municipal
> > > land
> > > transfer tax. They didn't listen to me, but I
> > think I had some
> > > influence on
> > > the fact that first time buyers are now receiving
> > a rebate
> > > municipally &
> > > provincially as well for all homes, not just new
> > homes. I guess
> > > that's
> > > something...
> > >
> > > --
> > > Wendy Forrrest
> > > Toronto Davenport candidate:
> > www.wendyforrest.com/capdavenport
> > >
> > > --
> > > If you don't stand for something, you will fall
> > for everything -
> > > Anonymous
> > >
> > >
> > > Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful,
> > committed citizens can
> > > change
> > > the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever
> > has - Margaret Mead
> > >
> > > ----- End forwarded message -----
>
>
>
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