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Subject:Re: [socialcredit] in further reply to Joe Thomson
Date:Sunday, March 23, 2008  11:05:58 (-0600)
From:Bob Taft <rbtaft @.........net>
In reply to:Message 5308 (written by Vicky Davis)

Back about 1957 or 58 I heard on the radio that the Geophysical Year scientists had figured that if the polar ice caps were to melt the ocean levels would rise at least 200 feet.  That made sense in the Noah's ark case, an early axis shift.
Now you can see pictures of NYC sitting barely above water level.  And the US Capitol building is said to sit about 83 feet above sea level. 
The Antarctic ice shelf sits atop mountains higher than any others throughout the world, including the Himalayas.  Were it to slide off the resulting world-wide tsunami would inundate every coastline in the world.  I would not miss DC or Wall Street.
Only day traders invest in the equity markets today.  There were about a hundred investment trusts fifty years ago.  Today there are over 5,000, now called mutual funds, for the ignorant investor.  The majority of shares in the Fortune 500 companies are today in government portfolios, not in private hands.  The time of investing for the long haul is over.  The system is crashing.  The Dollar is toast.
Note these two posts:
 
Add this to the mix:

"This just came to me from one of the forex newsletters I get.  This fellow has a reputation of being a bit of a trouble maker and always has something interesting to say. 

Hi there

This is Felix writing. In the middle of November of 2007, I had a gathering on a big yacht with 200 of our members. We discussed many things, but one of the things I suggested to people is to open bank accounts in Switzerland.

I suggested to people opening accounts with UBS, which at that time required a minimum deposit of only $100,000 US Dollars.

Today I received an email from my attorney who specializes in US Tax Law.

Here is exactly what the email said:

"I thought you would find this interesting: UBS is no longer accepting US clients.  current accounts will remain, but no new accounts. This is an amazing development. There are other options, but most require large deposits ($3m+) from US clients."

This email sent a shiver of disturbance up my spine for the following reasons.

1. I am not sure if you knew this or not, but after the stock market bust in the late 1920s, the US Government passed a law, which made "gold holdings" illegal. They instantly confiscated everyone's gold, and gave them pennies of what it was actually worth, and whoever tried to buy gold again, became a criminal and was either heavily fined or went to prison. This was a desperate act of the government to inspire people to keep spending their money and stop them from hoarding it in other instruments.

2. I am not sure if you knew this or not, but just a short while back, in 2006, the US government stopped reporting the size of its money supply. That basically means that since 2006, it has been creating money, and nobody in the world officially knows how much money has been put into circulation. This means that the US dollars might be so overinflated in value than most people even realize.

3. In the beginning of 2008, Chinese officials have mentioned for the second time within a few months that they are holding too many dollars, and they would like to diversify their portfolio. Please note that Japan and China have been the two biggest parties buying up dollars, and their demand for dollars is what has kept it afloat.

4. Several times in 2007, and perhaps before that, there were serious suggestions made by some European country officials to set Euro as currency to buy and sell oil with. The fact that demand for oil has been high, and that in order to buy oil, one must buy it in US dollars, has also kept demand for dollars high.

So, to make the long story short, we have the US Fed printing as much money as they want, with nobody knowing how much exactly they have been printing, and I have a feeling that the supply of US dollars is increasing a lot more rapidly than demand for them. In addition to that, there are threats from many different parts of the world to hinder demand for US dollars even further.

Now, I hope you understand more clearly why that email from my attorney disturbed me. If a major Swiss Bank is stopping to accept US accounts, perhaps it's one of many preparation steps from US government to make sure its citizens do not get their money out of the country, in case there is another major financial crisis similar to the Great Depression.

This is just another suggestion that if you have a lot of savings in US dollars or other US instruments, I strongly recommend to take it out of the country.

According to the words of my attorney, it seems like Switzerland has shut its doors, but perhaps doors into some other European countries are still open...

Interested to hear your thoughts and suggestions.
This also seems significant:
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Ray D
Sent: Friday, March 21, 2008 6:30 AM
Subject: [Crossover2012] American Refugees are flooding into Canada


http://www.mathaba.net/rss/?x=586176

American Refugees are flooding into Canada

In September of 2007, the city of Windsor, which borders the
United States, officially asked for financial assistance from
Ottawa to deal with American refugees flooding into Canada. This
is proving to be the tip of the iceberg, and only the first wave
of economic refugees that have been created in the United States.

There are now tent cities being built outside most large
metropolitan areas, one of the largest of which is in Los
Angeles. The following report from the BBC highlights the
consequence of the US subprime meltdown and the fears that the
crisis is growing.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7297093.stm

The homelessness situation has grown so rapidly in the United
States that certain cities are issuing color-coded wristbands -
blue for those who can stay, "orange for people who need to
provide more documentation, and white for those who must leave."
Refugees will no longer be able to stay in one area, meaning that
many towns and cities will now have to be prepared to receive
migrant refugees displaced by local governments from other
districts and States."

---
Ray
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2008 10:30 PM
Subject: Re: [socialcredit] in further reply to Joe Thomson

You really can't see what problem would be solved?   
 
I can't believe you took that literally.  It was an updated and green'd version of "a pox on all their houses"  :)
 
And if I was really advocating disasters, it wouldn't be in the same vein as disaster capitalism.  It would be more on the order of killing a cancer - to eliminate disease from the body.   

Joe Thomson <thomsonhiyu@shaw.ca> wrote:
Vicky, I think what many people still call 'investing' through the stock market is more in the nature of 'speculating' these days.  Possibly we all LOSE from that, even those who think they're ahead because they've bought and sold stocks at a profit. Since it may well be aiding in the destruction of the purchasing power of our currencies.
 
I really fail to see just what 'problem' would be solved by an earthquake causing the east coast of the USA to drop into the ocean. 
 
Seems to me the US has quite enough problems caused by recent natural disasters to contend with already, and none of them seem to have really 'solved' anything for the people affected by them. 
 
And for those not,  it's almost like saying we have to have continued disasters, or a war,  for there to be any (illusion of) prosperity in the country.  Surely we can do better than that in this day and age.
 
Joe
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2008 12:10 PM
Subject: Re: [socialcredit] in further reply to Joe Thomson

Why on earth would people with small amounts of money invest it in the stock market?  The stock market is a rigged game.  The little guys - even when they band together in mutual funds LOSE. 
 
Pray for an earthquake to drop the entire east coast of America into the ocean. 
 
That would solve the problem. 

william_b_ryan@yahoo.com wrote:
Just to expand somewhat, Joe, on my earlier reply.

Firms sell and consumers purchase goods, services AND
securities. The problem now is that consumers are
severely limited in their ability to purchase
securities, because they as a class have only a small
surplus in their wages and salaries over their costs
of living. With the Social Credit dividend and retail
discount, consumers will increasingly purchase
securities, and here I use the term broadly defined,
from which they will increasingly derive unearned
income in the form of dividends from firms whose
profit is being sustained through the Social Credit
program. The Social Credit dividend and discount are,
in the final analysis, nothing more than macroeconomic
accounting adjustments that compensate for the flaw in
double entry accounting demonstrated through the A + B
theorem, something like leap year adjustments to the
calendar. The full scope of the "dividend" in
Douglas's theory is not limited to the Social Credit
dividend and discount. Some of the profit to the
firms will be invested in new productive capacity
without the necessity for loans from the banks. The
result is an economy not nearly so financially
constrained as at present.

Bill


------------------original message-------------------

Bill, thanks for this explanation. This is truly
fascinating. It is a difficult conception for me to
immediately grasp, and I'm sure others would find it
so, too, since it requires looking at things in a way
far differently from the way we usually do. But put
as you've put it here, it does seem to make sense.

When you wrote one time before, I believe it was in a
discussion with Michael Lane a few years ago, that
consumers buy goods and services, and 'securities',
then with the Social Credit augmentations to income we
could expect to see a broadening of capital ownership,
(and more investment in 'new' product development and
discoveries), as the "propensity to consume",
(existing) product diminished and more of our
individual incomes could be directed into investment?

If that's the case, then that would certainly be
something different and more meaningful from what the
Kelso ESOP schemes, ("scams", because I think you're
right in what you've written previously about a lot of
them being just that), have to offer.

Joe


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Vicky Davis 
 
"If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen."  ~ Samuel Adams
 
 
 

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Vicky Davis 
 
"If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen."  ~ Samuel Adams
 
 
 


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Best regards,.
Bob Taft
The Taft Ranch
Upton, Wyoming
(307) 465-2206
"The man who reads nothing at all is better educated than the man
who reads nothing but newspapers." [Thomas Jefferson]
http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/archive.cgi?read=74897
"We hang the petty thieves and appoint
the great ones to public office." Aesop

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